Am I the only one who likes Reason for what it is?

[The Tone Ranger]

It seems like everyone here wants Reason to conform with everything else in the DAW market. They're pretty much abandoned Reason for their other DAW but still seem to hang around to tell us all how far behind the times Reason is.

Is there anyone who has actually choosen Reason for what it is or isn't? Who feels the only limit is their talent and creativity? Isn't envious of anything else because they have found what actually works for them?

[pushedbutton]

I love Reason. I'm not a big fan of the Re model and I think allihoopa is pretty much a waste of time but the core program is a joy to use.

[boobytrap]

Because the first DAW I saw in my life !

[motuscott]

Gosh darn DAW refuses to mow my lawn.
Now Pro Tools, there's some grass cutting software.

[chimp_spanner]

Not at all dude - I love Reason and I'd rather PH spent their energy making it the best at what it does rather than matching the feature set of other programs which themselves lack things that Reason has (and yet no-one expects *them* to change).

My only wants are minor workflow changes and basically a final 'polish' to make Reason that tiny bit more comfortable and easier to use.

[chk071]

It seems like everyone here wants Reason to conform with everything else in the DAW market. They're pretty much abandoned Reason for their other DAW but still seem to hang around to tell us all how far behind the times Reason is.

Is there anyone who has actually choosen Reason for what it is or isn't? Who feels the only limit is their talent and creativity? Isn't envious of anything else because they have found what actually works for them?

Tbh, i even wondered why PH opened to third party with RE's. I always took it for what it is, a whole all-in-one solution for your hardware studio tasks. If i want VST's, i wouldn't look at something like Reason, simply because there's better options for that. Implementing VST support ultimately would kill Reason IMO. It's whole architecture is made for connecting, and routing anyway, pretty much like you would do it in a physical studio. The VST format has its limitations in that regard, and Reason would be another VST host. And a bad one, because it's light years behind in terms of implementation, and also in terms of advanced DAW features DAW's like Cubase or Logic have. But, again, Reason never was made with that in mind. It was made with the things in mind it features now. So i'd take it for it is. I never understood the lamenting, always made me thought that the people talking like that should rather go VST.

[bxbrkrz]

No, you are not. We want Reason to be amazing and to keep getting better. Telling the Props what we want is a good thing, but some people are unhappy and do not care about Reason at all. You do not need 4 DAWs and complain all day long why Reason sucks. Don't feel bad about the low energy people. There is nothing you can do about them posting here. Compared to the original Propellerhead forum though, reasontalk is heaven. Enjoy Reason, enjoy life and be creative.

[WongoTheSane]

I'm glad someone started this thread, count me in! I love Reason as it is, and I'm tired of (some) people wanting it to be exactly as other DAWs, whining about every inconsequential difference or option they'd like included (which generally would break the model, but why think when you can whine?). What's the point??? I don't want a Live or FL clone, I don't want VSTs, I like the self-contained philosophy, the backwards compatibility and the rock-solid stability. I'll gladly give up on real-time sample slicing or whatever weekly fad is fashionable atm for those three points only. I'm a proud Reasonista!

[K.Markov]

^

this

[pjeudy]

It seems like everyone here wants Reason to conform with everything else in the DAW market. They're pretty much abandoned Reason for their other DAW but still seem to hang around to tell us all how far behind the times Reason is.

Is there anyone who has actually choosen Reason for what it is or isn't? Who feels the only limit is their talent and creativity? Isn't envious of anything else because they have found what actually works for them?

Here's the thing, it's impossible for REASON to stay the way it is! And depending on when you bought Reason it hasn't stayed the same. I'm not sure if people who bought Reason at version 1, would rather it stayed that way.

What Reason is, it's a product for consumers, if consumers don't give feedbacks then Props would send out surveys asking people what they wanted. Rack Extension they said was in reponse to people asking for plugins inside of Reason.
I understand the point of your post, you like Reason as is that's fine but if a restaurant only made the food that you like, how long would they be in business for ?

Criticism of Reason conforming to othere DAWs is interesting to me. What features can Propellerhead add to Reason for the next 5 -10 years that no othere DAW developers hadn't thought about, in order not to look like they are conforming? This idea stems from this "REASON is unique" mind set that has gotten out of hand in my opinion...this mind sets if Propellerhead where to buy into it, would make it almost impossible for them to advanced Reason for fear of people claiming that they are simply following other devs and not being original all the time.

There's plenty of room for people who request good features for Reason and for otheres who doesn't concern them selves with say.... plugin delay compensation. You see Reason is unique in this regard because it never had PDC and if they ever add it to Reason, would that be considered conforming to othere DAWs?

[chk071]

Pjeudy: Nice and good. But if you lose your vision, then your product, or your restaurant isn't worth a thing, and it won't be why people came there in the first place. Reason already opened, and responded to what the people (who could be wrong) demanded a LOT. Reason, in comparison with, like, what version 2.5 was like, already changed massively. It's a feature monster now, and already quite far from the easy to get into thing it used to be. And, frankly, RE's seem to be a half-hearted attempt to please the VST beggers. Of course, it's positive now, for the people who always wanted more than Reason offered, but, frankly, i don't think it fits the idea behind Reason. Cooks which spoil the soup and stuff. They should really be careful that this kind of thing doesn't happen too much, otherwise Reason will lose everything it once stood for. It's already a massive beast, which, for me, as a ex-user of version 2.5 is very hard to handle, because, basically, there has been added so much stuff that i'm having a hard time finding through all that stuff.

[joeyluck]

I like Reason just as it is

I'd only like to see improvements on what it is. Such as:
- A few more options in the Sequencer; like automation curves and audio fade curves.
- Favorites/arrangeable Rack Extensions in the Browser.
- Keep improving the RE SDK. Sample loading and Permut8 ready!

And further, under your profile / products:
- Be able to select which Rack Extensions you want to Sync when you 'Sync All'

Little things; I don't need to see much more changes than that. I can already get from point A to point B pretty quickly. Those extra options in the Sequencer would be very helpful as well as being able to organize Rack Extensions in the Browser. And I certainly don't need VST support; that is a great example of what Reason is not about. And I can only assume that the RE format will be even more capable and accommodating for developers in the future.

[pjeudy]

Well Reason being a massive beast is a relative point of view that even Propellerhead doesn't share, if they did they wouldn't have any developers at there headquaters.... if they should agree with you that Reason is good as is, then all they need is a technical support department and layoff the rest of there staff.

I have zero issue with someone liking the DAW as is. But saying that Reason is good as is , well that's an emotion talking which is cool, we all have them..... but Props can not leave Reason as is because it's a beast to you.
Your Wrong on Rack Extensions...it's not a half ass measure.... the ground works and the road they are taking is fantastic, (minus being only available in Reason etc....) they've been distracted by music sharing and frankly it takes time to develop a new plugin format from the ground up.

And since this is all points of views we are discussing. ..to me, Reason is awesome at what it does, it should do more and it will do more, but to be completely fair to all software developers in the world who are as talented as Propellerheads developers, who have created some fantastic FEATURES FOR there respective DAW, and being unbiased towards any of them... Reason is not a Beast! But it doesn't to be.

[Noplan]

My friends served me pretty much every cracked DAW and plugin for free. I don't know if they did it out of pity but I denied it every time and not because i'm an upright person. I rather hate to deal with the glut of plugins/instruments and lose the focus.

Reasons limitation does not distract me from making music and teached me to be more self-critical instead of switching to the next plugin. I was forced to explore all knobs and tricks. That's the reason why i love reason.

[pjeudy]

It's already a massive beast, which, for me, as a ex-user of version 2.5 is very hard to handle, because, basically, there has been added so much stuff that i'm having a hard time finding through all that stuff.

I'm always understanding of someone's experience and opinions, I hear you loud and clear when I read your quote above! But Reason 8 being harder to handle then Reason 2.5 as a negative, might put you in the minority.

[chk071]

My friends served me pretty much every cracked DAW and plugin for free. I don't know if they did it out of pity but I denied it every time and not because i'm an upright person. I rather hate to deal with the glut of plugins/instruments and lose the focus.

After a while, you know your way around, and you know what is what and what does what. There's no need for quantity anyway, i have 3 payware synths i more or less regularly use (well mostly 2), a few reverbs, because that's something which is really subjective, and every reverb sounds a bit different, a go-to delay, phaser and chorus. Mostly use the onboard stuff which comes with the VST though, as that's really quality now too with most plugins which come out now. The different part was to find something which sounds good to ME. I tried literally 100's of synths to find those which really sound good to me. Which is also the issue i have with Reason. There simply is no synth device in it which sounds as good as the stuff i have as VST's to me. YMMV of course.

[chk071]

It's already a massive beast, which, for me, as a ex-user of version 2.5 is very hard to handle, because, basically, there has been added so much stuff that i'm having a hard time finding through all that stuff.

I'm always understanding of someone's experience and opinions, I hear you loud and clear when I read your quote above! But Reason 8 being harder to handle then Reason 2.5 as a negative, might put you in the minority.

When was the last time you fired up 2.5? If you really say that, in a comparison, you find both equally easy to handle, then i am quite surprised. As Reason 8 has tons more stuff than 2.5, and due to that, and the integration of Record, it's also more cluttered per default. If you know your way around Reason, fair enough. But maybe view it from the view point of a beginner who just fired up Reason for the first time. Maybe even after having used something like version 2.5. Especially the SSL mixer was very confusing for me. Not in version 8 though, but in version 7. Hardly fit on the screen on my laptop.

[Noplan]

My friends served me pretty much every cracked DAW and plugin for free. I don't know if they did it out of pity but I denied it every time and not because i'm an upright person. I rather hate to deal with the glut of plugins/instruments and lose the focus.

After a while, you know your way around, and you know what is what and what does what. There's no need for quantity anyway, i have 3 payware synths i more or less regularly use (well mostly 2), a few reverbs, because that's something which is really subjective, and every reverb sounds a bit different, a go-to delay, phaser and chorus. Mostly use the onboard stuff which comes with the VST though, as that's really quality now too with most plugins which come out now. The different part was to find something which sounds good to ME. I tried literally 100's of synths to find those which really sound good to me. Which is also the issue i have with Reason. There simply is no synth device in it which sounds as good as the stuff i have as VST's to me. YMMV of course.

Don't get me wrong. I'm aware that there are a lot of better synths plugins in the vst world. I limit myself intentionally to get the most out of "crap".

Like a bushcrafter who sleeps in the woods and builds a shelter and makes fire with only one knife and is very proud of it.

[chk071]

Hehe. Well, i wouldn't say Reason or its devices are crap, but, IMO, compared to what's available now (and at the time the Reason device came out), they're average at best. But the in-the-box appeal is in no way neglectable. Also, for people who work a lot with samples and loops, Reason will be hard to beat by any DAW out there. For synth fetishists, IMO, there's better options out there.

[pjeudy]

the SSL mixer was very confusing for me. Not in version 8 though, but in version 7. Hardly fit on the screen on my laptop.

I understand!

[pjeudy]

for people who work a lot with samples and loops, Reason will be hard to beat by any DAW out there. For synth fetishists, IMO, there's better options out there.

I think you have it backwards in away. REASON is awesome for running audio through other synths and CV modulations and saving a complex patch is the best around! Audio editing? Not so much.

[willowman]

Nope...I'm loving reason and hating the hate, it ain't perfect but what daw is ?, the haters always make me think of the old adage 'a bad workman always blames his tools'.

[groggy1]

For me, Reason is *perfect* when it comes to sequencing. I used to do all my sequencing in Sonar, and I'm not sure why I like the Reason sequencing so much more. I think because it's just simple, and makes sense, and no fluff.

So I doubt I'll leave Reason in the next 5 years: Just too addicted to the sequencer.

But, for me, Reason isn't perfect: I want a simpler way to use my VSTs, rather than jumping through so many hoops (and I hate the workflow of ReWire, because then I don't get to use Reason's sequencer 100%).

That's my two cents.

[avasopht]

You know, I think it's too easy to get caught up in the desire for features without being aware that sometimes less is more and worse is better.

For all the features Reason doesn't have, one thing it does is high intuitiveness. It's feature set is small enough to fit inside my memory and instincts and provide an environment that allows me enter a mental state of flow.

A DAW tries to be a bit of a monolith, playing a wide variety of roles within a single interface. A single look at the Reason UI tells you that if you keep on adding the UI is going to become increasingly complex, which I don't think is a good thing. Reason used to be a case of doing one thing really well, and by merging Reason and Record they widened their problem domain, opening up the doors to conflicts of concern.

I feel Propellerhead were onto something when Reason and Record were separate, that is now lost. Maybe Reason could become more like a regular daw with the racks being used more for single combinators, though still having the complete rack connections going on in the background, just perhaps in a more organized manner.

[guitfnky]

I'm totally with you. I love what Reason is. Of course there have been things on my wish list since I started using it, but generally, they've been what most DAWs might consider necessities. There's really only one thing I have left on my list, and I'm hopeful that it will appear in Reason 9. Other than that, the workflow is great, the flexibility is amazing, the sound quality is top-notch, and most importantly, it continues to be an inspiring tool for making music.