REASON gets VST !!!!!!

[Chizmata]

if this is true, i'm going from 99% "never upgrade beyond reason 8.3" to 100%. in fact im thinking about downgrading to 5...

[stevan]

Having read a rough translation of the article via the oh-so-shaky medium of Google Translate, this all sounds VERY speculative to me. They hint at a surefire source who has apparently been accurate in the past, but specify that this is not "100% secured". So they don't really know any more than we do - (which amounts to nothing!)

So far, there is exactly one way to use effects or plug-ins in Reason: You use the ones as Rack Extension (RE). These are mainly special effects developed for Reasons rack system, but with the disadvantage that only a few plug-in manufacturers use the interface. This could now be fundamentally changed or obsolete.

Reason is to get VST. To what extent and in what form, we unfortunately do not know. Only that it should happen quite soon. It is not a rumor generated in forums, but an information from a reliable source in the past. Nevertheless, it is not 100% secured.

Is the Propellerheads trying to pull the rudder for Reason again? Reason plays as a special DAW rather a subordinate role in the market - which is nothing bad and VST is definitely more interesting for many users than ever. Another step (after MIDI out) towards the user. Or will it simply happen, because Steinberg the VST3 interface now under Open Source license drives?

It would also be interesting to know whether Reason 9.5 or 10 is planned. Is actually already a very buyable update.
It is said to happen soon. Maybe tomorrow, maybe only early May. We keep you up to date. So always look again.

Personally, I have very mixed feelings about the potential availability of VSTs in Reason. I would hate to see it compromise the viability of Rack Extensions and the developers who specialise in them. I love being part of an exclusive little gang of mavericks and outliers, who are working with a slightly different toolkit from the rest of the world. I don't really want that to change too much, especially if it means we'll get fewer of the quirky, unique products we've seen recently.

And more worryingly, I think there's a really serious risk that it will destroy the delicate little ecosystem that keeps both Props and RE developers afloat. If people start buying VSTs instead of REs (or, let's face it, 'pirating' VSTs - because I honestly think the easy availability of cracks is what drives a lot of the demand for VST integration), then that's a mighty chunk of revenue which will not make its way to Propellerheads, and that is bound to make the future of Reason a riskier proposition. I very much want Reason to still be around in 15 years. It's the only DAW I feel 100% comfortable with, and the only one which feels like an actual 'musical instrument' in its own right.

... exactly, VST would act like a furious virus in our hermetically locked Reason world. I hate to say it, but I hope it's not true ...

[Karim]

I love being part of an exclusive little gang of mavericks and outliers, who are working with a slightly different toolkit from the rest of the world. I.

I love too but to have many more Reason users onboard (and cadenced updates every 2 years) are not bad.
The company wants to make money and maybe after the latest recent investments, " investors"
are pressing for the same demand: "Support vst yelled loudly!"

 I can count tens, hundreds, if not thousands of colleagues (more or less famous, by lucky dates from James Bernard)
who have abandoned the wonderful ecosystem for commercially more successful products such as Ableton live.
If these were to return to propellerhead hands, considering the risk of system instability, this could be beneficial.
Only Propellerhead had the courage to invent a completely new and revolutionary plugin format
But it may not be enough to keep the whole cabin alive.

However, I am among those not least interested in VSTs, because
I have a long want-list of near 40-50 features to be implemented before VST compatibility
But so many reason users are minded by these fantomists vst and in more than ten years maybe.....

but time will tell...

Cheers

[chrischrischris]

NG.png (36.91 KiB) Viewed 2087 times

Just to add to The Speculation!!!!

Chris

[raymondh]

Yup, sure ... , that would vaporize the RE market in seconds ... so, forget it

I'm not so sure about this. Imagine the user base would double because of VST Support. Even if the existing users wouldn't spend so much money anymore for RE's, the increase of new users who would sometimes buy a RE as well would compensate for that.

Exactly right.
In fact it is possible the rack extension market could become more lucrative, if the Reason installed base grows (due to VST users jumping on board).

There are many benefits to the rack extension UX and features that won't be available in VSTi's, so it doesn't automatically mean people will buy VST instruments rather than Rack Extensions.

The strategy conversations at Propellerhead HQ must be fascinating. A decision (if there was one) to support VSTs could substantially change the shape of their business over time.

[satyr32]

if this is true they will somehow destroy their USP, which is the rack, the audio and cv connections. let's face the truth: the sequencer in Live and the overall features are far more advanced than in Reason. i just do not like this news. Reason might change in a direction i do not like my favourite daw is going. i would rather see them implementing other new features the user are longing for. or maybe developing a Reason dedicated midi gear including a sampler.

i am pretty sure the news is correct since they sold large portions of their shares to an investment company. I am afraid of the future ^^

[Marc Swing]

OOOH!! I HOPE THIS IS TRUE!!!! VST IN REASON!!!! YEEEESSS!!!!

[Karim]

[emoji108] [emoji108] [emoji108]

Inviato dal mio SM-G925F utilizzando Tapatalk

[RDS]

Why should the user base of Reason increase with VST-support? I doubt anyone would drop Logic, Cubase etc, and get into Reason instead?!?

And I strongly believe that some, or quite a lot of them actually, of the individuals screaming for VST-support are the one that will raid piratebay for cracks the second it is confirmed that Reason will support VST.

I hope PH, if they include VST, has found a way, to stop the use of cracks and verify to use of VST through the shop.

It will also kill must of the RE development, no more Softube or other VST-developer. Why spend resources if you dont have to?

So f-k all you VST-screamers!

[Oquasec]

I feel like this is a bait thread and which is why vst support should never be added to reason.
It's userbase is a huge reason, reason should only support vsts through rewire and emi which already solved that problem ages ago aka the beginning of reason ago. Making the emi a combinator that houses these external plugins would be welcomed, but nothing more integrated than that.

[chk071]

I feel like this is a bait thread and which is why vst support should never be added to reason.

Did you actually visit the link in the OP?

[chk071]

Why should the user base of Reason increase with VST-support? I doubt anyone would drop Logic, Cubase etc, and get into Reason instead?!?

That's what i'm wondering too. Who would leave his VST host for Reason? Reason would have to have something special, and VST's don't work with Reason's routing possibilites.

[fieldframe]

I get the anxiety around this, but everyone who thinks VST will kill RE is missing the elephant in the room: RE is an island. There's a handful of VST developers that also develop for RE, but the vast majority of RE dev shops are RE-only.

So two things:

The RE-only dev shops aren't going to suddenly switch to VST. Would make no sense.

The VST developers aren't going to stop supporting RE... because almost none of them do right now.

Now the few VST devs that also develop for RE, they might have second thoughts. But these are also pretty stalwart Reason shops. Does anyone really think Rob Papen will abandon the rack and say "get the VST instead?" Will Synapse forget all the groundwork they did to make cross-platform synths like Legend? I doubt it.

[Oquasec]

I clicked the link. What the fuck's gonna happen to the modular workflow if this shit gets put into reason?
Will this be properly implemented or will it just be another method like rewire/emi?

I don't give a fuck, if it impedes reason in any way shape or form don't add that stupid shit in there imo.
No cv routing at the back or the inability to use the fucking combi to be a modmatrix for vsts is not something that makes sense.

It's a waste of time and you'd actually be better off JUST USING REWIRE OR EMI/LOOPBACKING SINCE THAT WOULD JUST BE REDUNDANT UNLESS THEY MAKE A CUSTOM CV WRAPPER OR EMI COMBI THAT LETS YOU TREAT THE VSTS LIKE REASON DEVICES WITHOUT THE NEED FOR MAKING THEM RES.
WTF 6666666

I'm legit worried about the hell's reason future with this being announced

[fieldframe]

Why should the user base of Reason increase with VST-support? I doubt anyone would drop Logic, Cubase etc, and get into Reason instead?!?

That's what i'm wondering too. Who would leave his VST host for Reason? Reason would have to have something special, and VST's don't work with Reason's routing possibilites.

Are you guys kidding? Why did you choose Reason over Logic or Cubase?

There absolutely are people who love Reason for exactly the same reasons you do, but it's not their main DAW because of Omnisphere, Reaktor, Kontakt, or the like. This will let them make Reason their daily driver.

[noelcampbelljnr]

Why should the user base of Reason increase with VST-support? I doubt anyone would drop Logic, Cubase etc, and get into Reason instead?!?

That's what i'm wondering too. Who would leave his VST host for Reason? Reason would have to have something special, and VST's don't work with Reason's routing possibilites.

Are you guys kidding? Why did you choose Reason over Logic or Cubase?

There absolutely are people who love Reason for exactly the same reasons you do, but it's not their main DAW because of Omnisphere, Reaktor, Kontakt, or the like. This will let them make Reason their daily driver.

100% agree here.This will also make Reason a very attractive option for first time buyers of DAWs. All the great ease of use and creative flexability of the back of the racks but with high level VST plugins so you can complete all your projects in one place.

If true this will be the best thing to happen since Reason 2.0

[chk071]

See, any VST host out there is light years ahead in terms of implementation of VST, and functionality. What made Reason special was the in the box approach, and, especially, the modular capabilities when you turn the rack. Implementing VST robs Reason of all that speciality, and leaves the sequencer functionality, because VST's won't work with the modular stuff. What would make Reason so special then that someone would choose it over Logic, Cubase, or Studio One? That's also the question PH should ask themselves.

[noelcampbelljnr]

See, any VST host out there is light years ahead in terms of implementation of VST, and functionality. What made Reason special was the in the box approach, and, especially, the modular capabilities when you turn the rack. Implementing VST robs Reason of all that speciality, and leaves the sequencer functionality, because VST's won't work with the modular stuff. What would make Reason so special then that someone would choose it over Logic, Cubase, or Studio One? That's also the question PH should ask themselves.

disagree completely.Reason will still have the rack and its unique selling point. but if you want to add VST you can. Nothing would stop you from not buying VST and sticking to reason devices and RE devices.

You would have the option of best of both worlds.

I would say though after you get Komplete and Uhe running beside reason devices you will change your tune

[chk071]

Ok, fair enough. I guess only time will tell in the end. Maybe i'm wrong. Obviously, i already was wrong that Reason will never support VST. I can only explain this move with the new owners though. Don't think PH would have made such bold move, ever.

[raymondh]

Gees there's a fair amount of emotion on this thread.

I remember back in the old PUF forum quite a bit of concern over MIDI-Out and even Rack Extensions being compromising the purity of the closed box platform, and look where we are now. I think we need to have a bit of confidence that whatever Propellerhead does (and we don't actually know) then they will do it with style.

[satyr32]

if this is true, doesn't it mean that REs were not as successful as they hoped to be? otherwise from a business perspective it would have been wiser to implement vst in the first place instead of spending thousands of dollars in developing the RE format, SDK and whatnot.

[Oquasec]

THAT IS THE PROLLEM. WHAT WOULD PROPS DO THAT REWIRE OR EMI/LOOPBACKING DOES NOT ALREADY DO?
YOU'VE NEVER NEEDED ANOTHER DAW TO DO ANY OF THAT SINCE THE FIRST ONE AND DOING SO WOULD ADD NO BENEFITS BECAUSE IF PROPS DOESN'T MAKE ANOTHER EMI THAT LETS YOU DRAG VSTS INSIDE OF AN EMI WITH REASON'S FEATURES IT WOULD BASICALLY BE JUST ANOTHER METHOD TO ADD TO THE LIST OF METHODS YOU NEED TO GET VSTS IN REASON.

I AM NOT SAYING IT'S A BAD IDEA IF IMPLEMENTED CORRECTLY, BUT DOING THIS WOULD BASICALLY BE THE SAME THING AS JUST MAKING A RACK EXTENSION AND AS SUCH YOU ARE JUST BETTER OFF USING EXTERNAL VST HOSTS LIKE MINIHOST MODULAR OR SAVIHOST THAT WOULD PROBABLY STILL HAVE MORE FEATURES PACKED INTO THEM SINCE THEY WERE BUILT SPECIFICALLY FOR THIS PURPOSE SO THAT PROPELLERHEAD DIDNT HAVE TO WHILE MAINTAINING A MODULAR RACK OML.

HOWEVER, PROPELLERHEAD BUILDING THEIR OWN LOOPBACK FOR REASON IS A GOOD IDEA SO THAT YOU COULD BOUNCE MIDI TO AUDIO WITHOUT USING VOICEMETER. CAUTIOUSLY OPTIMISTIC AND PISSED OFF AT THE SAME TIME

[RDS]

Why should the user base of Reason increase with VST-support? I doubt anyone would drop Logic, Cubase etc, and get into Reason instead?!?

That's what i'm wondering too. Who would leave his VST host for Reason? Reason would have to have something special, and VST's don't work with Reason's routing possibilites.

Are you guys kidding? Why did you choose Reason over Logic or Cubase?

There absolutely are people who love Reason for exactly the same reasons you do, but it's not their main DAW because of Omnisphere, Reaktor, Kontakt, or the like. This will let them make Reason their daily driver.

Reason is easy to use, never had one crash, and exporting stems is quick (if I have to). But what I can't understand is the constant demand for Reason to be just like all the other hosts instead of enjoy that it is one of a kind.

I have Reason on my laptop, Logic on my desktop (and that is Logic 8 on a G5 running on 8 or 9 years but still going strong) and Studio One on a PC just for trying it out!

So I didn't choose Reason over anything... Reason is one of my tools, and one that was special if it is no longer special then, well I guess I will drop it...

[Karim]

THAT IS THE PROLLEM. WHAT WOULD PROPS DO THAT REWIRE OR EMI/LOOPBACKING DOES NOT ALREADY DO?
YOU'VE NEVER NEEDED ANOTHER DAW TO DO ANY OF THAT SINCE THE FIRST ONE AND DOING SO WOULD ADD NO BENEFITS BECAUSE IF PROPS DOESN'T MAKE ANOTHER EMI THAT LETS YOU DRAG VSTS INSIDE OF AN EMI WITH REASON'S FEATURES IT WOULD BASICALLY BE JUST ANOTHER METHOD TO ADD TO THE LIST OF METHODS YOU NEED TO GET VSTS IN REASON.

I AM NOT SAYING IT'S A BAD IDEA IF IMPLEMENTED CORRECTLY, BUT DOING THIS WOULD BASICALLY BE THE SAME THING AS JUST MAKING A RACK EXTENSION AND AS SUCH YOU ARE JUST BETTER OFF USING EXTERNAL VST HOSTS LIKE MINIHOST MODULAR OR SAVIHOST THAT WOULD PROBABLY STILL HAVE MORE FEATURES PACKED INTO THEM SINCE THEY WERE BUILT SPECIFICALLY FOR THIS PURPOSE SO THAT PROPELLERHEAD DIDNT HAVE TO WHILE MAINTAINING A MODULAR RACK OML.

HOWEVER, PROPELLERHEAD BUILDING THEIR OWN LOOPBACK FOR REASON IS A GOOD IDEA SO THAT YOU COULD BOUNCE MIDI TO AUDIO WITHOUT USING VOICEMETER. CAUTIOUSLY OPTIMISTIC AND PISSED OFF AT THE SAME TIME

my poors ears.... [emoji16]

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[Oquasec]

I'm seriously about to lose my shit is that link real? I'm not saying no to not needing another damn daw in ANOTHER STREAMLINED method