Reason updates (11.3.7 / 11.3.8) and Reason+

[EnochLight]

If Reason made $10 million in sales off Evolution Sequencer.....

MoneyPanda3.jpg (94.23 KiB) Viewed 3072 times

LOL!!! Best photo ever. I think we can lock this thread now.

[Faastwalker]

I feel that too and it's been going on for a while. I don't see companies like Sternberg and Ableton going thru a constant need for reinvention . They just put their heads down and try to churn out consistent software improvements, rather than focusing on their next big scheme.

Focus on the core product and the users will go out into forums and their communities and evangelize for free. At the moment it's the exact opposite happening. I've never seen even close to half the outrage on any Steinberg or Ableton forum for a release or an announcement. Is it just Reason users being unusually picky compared to other DAW users?

Ultimately Reason 12 is going to be a major decider in what happens moving forward. I feel like it needs to address a clear majority of the workflow issues and have an amazing GUI rebuild. It has to be the release that says to the long time customers "Im so sorry I came home last night at 3am smelling like liquor and whores, please dont leave me."

Definitely. They should have waited for 'Reason 12' before launching Reason+. Would have been better timing. As it is now, certainly for existing users, they are pretty much trying to sell Reason+ on the sound packs, which is not much of an incentive at all as far as I'm concerned. A lot of talk about, 'what we have coming in the future'. That's not good enough. We want to see what they've got before even thinking about pulling the trigger on Reason+

If it could have been 'Buy the R12 upgrade OR subscribe to Reason+ to get the R12 upgrade + access to all Reason Studios device + the sound packs + whatever else they had up their sleeve by this time. I think that would have gone down just a little better than it has!! It looks like a PR/Marketing disaster on these shores and most other places I've seen it talked about.

[certifiedbeatz]

Best way to get our point across just keep using what we have and wait until reason 12 .. when they see the subscription is a flop then they will have to make a decision..

[EnochLight]

Best way to get our point across just keep using what we have and wait until reason 12 .. when they see the subscription is a flop then they will have to make a decision..

What if it's not a flop? Older users and users that prefer perpetual licenses aren't the target market. That said, I'm looking forward to Reason 12 for sure.

[Raveshaper]

1. "Ultimately Reason 12 is going to be a major decider in what happens moving forward. ..."

2. "Definitely. They should have waited for 'Reason 12' before launching Reason+. ...It looks like a PR/Marketing disaster on these shores and most other places I've seen it talked about."

Regarding 1: NO!
Regarding 2: Of course.

I was reading comments earlier because I couldn't resist, and I laughed so hard!

Seriously, I have been gone for a long time and these problems haven't changed at all.

In that time I have learned and done a ton, but the most important, meaningful, and satisfying stuff I've done has been proactively facing my problems and overcoming them. I used to be afraid of heights, for example. I had a lot of trauma to work through and I'm not haunted by it anymore. I've learned a ton of things in my chosen field and reached new milestones that will pay into my future. And so on.

So, let me share my proactive and positive approach here. Ignore me if you want, that's cool too.

If you're hanging on for Reason 12 to be a "major decider" for whether or not you stay, you've already made your decision. Because people have said that about versions 7+, and... they're still disappointed every release. "Release" yourself and get excited over which new tool you're going to add to your knowledge. Hang on to your current version of R, pick up something else, give that a try.

Try to think along the lines of:

"what can I do right now that will support my emotional and creative well being?"

There's something called the sphere of influence. Some may say that theirs is large, but everybody's is the same size. It only has room enough for one: oneself. Even if an influential person inspires someone in a certain way, that person is still making the decision to influence themselves as a response to stimuli.

That being as it is, Reason Studios is a company. It is staffed by people who are individuals. Their business is theirs and what they do from day to day is managed within their individual spheres of influence. A long way of saying they're gonna do what they're gonna do.

So, do what you're gonna do by doing what you can do within your personal sphere of influence. Take action productively against these unwanted feelings and place your energy in an area of growth. However that manifests for you, you'll know that it's what you need if you give your mind the space to find it. That's the only sure thing and time is better spent while happy.

* * *

Let me hazard a bit of mild speculation.

• They hyped the ability to edit notes from the left and browse in-app as an effort to draw in lots of users, to no avail.
• They released expensive RE units for free in new versions to draw in lots of users, to no avail.
• They released new instruments and effects in an already saturated RE market as an effort to draw in lots of users, to no avail.
• They have had sale after sale on RE units as an effort to draw in lots of users, to no avail.
• They released a buggy Rack plugin that could load R into other DAWs as an effort to draw in lots of users, to no avail.
• Now they're releasing some sort of pay monthly access to things that might have already been paid for as an effort to draw in lots of users, and based on the response it will likely be the biggest "to no avail" yet.

Given this direction and pattern over the past several years, how much more can be done before Verdane says they've exhausted their options and the plug is getting pulled? Music is a business, and business is looking bad here.

Quick recap of my efforts at presenting a positive approach to all this.
I have been gone at least since Reason Suite launched, so a little over one year. In that time I have grown and done a lot. Picture yourself a little over a year from now. What do you want to have accomplished in that time?

I should put it another way: you already know what you don't want to be doing, so why not stop now? Or stick to it, it's your sphere of influence. You're gonna do what you're gonna do, after all.

Stay safe in this crazy covid world and save your passion for the music.
I'm out!

[Catblack]

That said, I'm looking forward to Reason 12 for sure.

Has it been confirmed that the upgrade to 12 (when it happens) will be the same $129 that they usually charge for upgrades?

[Aosta]

This guy gets it...

[EnochLight]

That said, I'm looking forward to Reason 12 for sure.

Has it been confirmed that the upgrade to 12 (when it happens) will be the same $129 that they usually charge for upgrades?

No, though they did say it would be "similarly priced" as it has been in the past. If it does go up in cost at all, I doubt it will be a lot.

[certifiedbeatz]

Best way to get our point across just keep using what we have and wait until reason 12 .. when they see the subscription is a flop then they will have to make a decision..

What if it's not a flop? Older users and users that prefer perpetual licenses aren't the target market. That said, I'm looking forward to Reason 12 for sure.

Im a older user also but I don't want to go on a rant and get banned like I have in another forum..lol

Im just saying its like going from record to tape then CD's we all hated it.. I am 20 year IT engineer I hated the cloud but I had to adapt .. now this subscription is just that to the younger gen.. they won't understand license.. they want now. I get it but it's not a hobby model unless u treat it like a $20 hassle a month steal the sounds and resell.. again what is the licensing involving sound packs? Are they royalty free if so this is a hassle market and if I had the time I would do it.. my thoughts.....

[sprinkles__]

The more i look at the Reason+ logo the more i see this:

reason_plus.jpg (126.55 KiB) Viewed 2883 times

[sprinkles__]

Reason † haha
GIve it a year. 2 tops. Then the vultures scour the corpse.

[miscend]

Now it's clear that this is something that won't appeal to their core user base. I think it could have gone down better had they rebranded it to something else like Allihoopa+ or even Reason Compact Plus. Just to make it clear to hardcore users that this doesn't replace the standard Reason and it is a different option. Most people when they heard Reason+ they thought omg Reason was getting replaced by a new subscription service.

[ClassickHitz]

I think Reason Studios missed the mark in fully explaining this to existing users. They should have straight up clarified if upgrades would still be the same $129US price point. This way, so many long time users wouldn't have to sift through this guessing game of the possible additional out of pocket they'll have to pay for v12 and future upgrades moving forward.

[EnochLight]

They should have straight up clarified if upgrades would still be the same $129US price point. This way, so many long time users wouldn't have to sift through this guessing game of the possible additional out of pocket they'll have to pay for v12 and future upgrades moving forward.

They did verify that upgrades will cost similar to what they cost now for perpetual licenses in the Livestream. I agree it would have been smart to make this clearer on their product pages or a FAQ. I suspect that will happen in short order.

[zoidkirb]

Is it just Reason users being unusually picky compared to other DAW users?

It's more that it's Reason users airing their sense of being given the short end of the stick, yet again, when their requests are still being ignored and for years Reason has been in a kind of functional coma.

Agreed.

Ultimately Reason 12 is going to be a major decider in what happens moving forward. I feel like it needs to address a clear majority of the workflow issues and have an amazing GUI rebuild. It has to be the release that says to the long time customers "Im so sorry I came home last night at 3am smelling like liquor and whores, please dont leave me."

I think R12 is highly anticipated as always but in the end it will be another typical release. The people who skip versions will upgrade from R10 (that's me) , and people on R11 will take it or leave it as usual. R+ subs will chug along but it aint gonna get wildly popular.
"More of the same" is my prediction

[Faastwalker]

They should have straight up clarified if upgrades would still be the same $129US price point. This way, so many long time users wouldn't have to sift through this guessing game of the possible additional out of pocket they'll have to pay for v12 and future upgrades moving forward.

They did verify that upgrades will cost similar to what they cost now for perpetual licenses in the Livestream. I agree it would have been smart to make this clearer on their product pages or a FAQ. I suspect that will happen in short order.

It was very unclear from the outset. The cynic in me thinks that it was quite deliberate in order to make people think Reason+ was the only way and push them towards the subscription model. Same reason for moving the shop link to the very bottom of the page in the footer. An explanation was given that they didn't want the 'shop' link to steal the limelight from Reason+ but I'm not buying that. Explaining things in the LiveStream was not good enough. The way Reason+ has been launched I think has been a bit of mess. Again, we're looking forward to see how it pans out.

[fieldframe]

Try to think along the lines of:

"what can I do right now that will support my emotional and creative well being?"

There's something called the sphere of influence. Some may say that theirs is large, but everybody's is the same size. It only has room enough for one: oneself. Even if an influential person inspires someone in a certain way, that person is still making the decision to influence themselves as a response to stimuli.

That being as it is, Reason Studios is a company. It is staffed by people who are individuals. Their business is theirs and what they do from day to day is managed within their individual spheres of influence. A long way of saying they're gonna do what they're gonna do.

So, do what you're gonna do by doing what you can do within your personal sphere of influence. Take action productively against these unwanted feelings and place your energy in an area of growth. However that manifests for you, you'll know that it's what you need if you give your mind the space to find it. That's the only sure thing and time is better spent while happy.

This is way too emotionally healthy for this forum.

If you're hanging on for Reason 12 to be a "major decider" for whether or not you stay, you've already made your decision. Because people have said that about versions 7+, and... they're still disappointed every release. "Release" yourself and get excited over which new tool you're going to add to your knowledge. Hang on to your current version of R, pick up something else, give that a try.

The "major decider" line of thought seems to me like it's rooted in a projection of interpersonal relationships onto what should be a purely utilitarian decision. The new version will be either worth buying to you, or not. The version you have is either worth continuing to use, or not. There is no "leave" or "stay." Reason is a creative tool, not a girlfriend.

[MannequinRaces]

Quick recap of my efforts at presenting a positive approach to all this.
I have been gone at least since Reason Suite launched, so a little over one year. In that time I have grown and done a lot. Picture yourself a little over a year from now. What do you want to have accomplished in that time?

Just wanted to say great to hear from you and nice influx of some much needed positivity and perspective in this thread. If you did peace out you might not see this but thanks!

[Faastwalker]

This guy gets it...

Spot on. Almost exactly how I feel and I'm sure a majority of existing users. In regards to the ongoing cost of subscription he talks about - I did a rough calculation to work out how much I would have paid for Reason if it was $20 a month since I first bought it on Version 2.0. That's roughly 18 years give or take. That comes out around $4,300 Is that good for 18 years? It's somewhat more than what I've spent in that time on Reason, upgrades, Propellerhead / Reason studio RE's and Refills that's for sure.

[Timmy Crowne]

Quick recap of my efforts at presenting a positive approach to all this.
I have been gone at least since Reason Suite launched, so a little over one year. In that time I have grown and done a lot. Picture yourself a little over a year from now. What do you want to have accomplished in that time?

Just wanted to say great to hear from you and nice influx of some much needed positivity and perspective in this thread. If you did peace out you might not see this but thanks!

I echo that sentiment. Always liked reading your contributions to the forum, both for your technical prowess and your sensible assessment of the state of the product. This latest post is well-written and I appreciate the message. Good to hear from you, Raveshaper.

[Gothi]

As said earlier, I only got onboard Reason again this summer after abandoning it (and software in general) when 6.5. was released. I see and hear many people talking about long wanted features that RS now has neglected in favor of Reason+. There has always been an ongoing request for features afair, sometimes quite heated because users had to wait decades for them to show up. However, can anyone give me a recap of the present ones?

[Popey]

Does anyone remember if they stated if there will be differences between perpetual licence purchase and reason + (other than getting all the re's). Specifically they mentioned a new synth in March and I could not recall if they mentioned if this will be in the next reason version or if it would only be available free with + (like they did with scenic in the reason suite) ?

[Loque]

Does anyone remember if they stated if there will be differences between perpetual licence purchase and reason + (other than getting all the re's). Specifically they mentioned a new synth in March and I could not recall if they mentioned if this will be in the next reason version or if it would only be available free with + (like they did with scenic in the reason suite) ?

Its INCLUDED in R+.
You probably still can buy it as usual.
Nobody knows, what comes in the next R12...

[Popey]

Does anyone remember if they stated if there will be differences between perpetual licence purchase and reason + (other than getting all the re's). Specifically they mentioned a new synth in March and I could not recall if they mentioned if this will be in the next reason version or if it would only be available free with + (like they did with scenic in the reason suite) ?

Its INCLUDED in R+.
You probably still can buy it as usual.
Nobody knows, what comes in the next R12...

Thanks Loque I couldn't recall if they were clear on this. Sub isn't personally for me as I like to own stuff I pay for and was thinking it probably wont be so potential upgrade price if I wanted it is likely £129 r12 (or whatever it is called) plus approx £99 for the synth. Roughly about the same as a years sub but I get to keep it.

[Yonatan]

If RS had announced this alongside new upgrade, and that they have hired a new coding team to double the updates and really focus on the details of the core Reason DAW, that would have been more reassuring, but now it is only "please subscribe now in advance so that we can also work on the feature list sometime later". But all it appears for us is that RS seem to hire new ppl connected to the Reason+ gimmick and social media fluff marketing.
Everyone can make beats, it is not more beats that the world needs. There is a flood of beats. I think it is a shortsighted view to put all else at procrastination, just to try to please the imagined "blip-blop" crowd whose attention span is as long as a Tic-toc clip.

Yes, quite some will certainly buy into R+ just to be on the hype side of it, and that will bring in some new ones, but will it be sustainable?
I doubt RS will come to hire new teams to work with the coding. As many also seems to jump the ship, it might be that what RS win in new testers, they might loose an the other end. If they designed a sub system which involved staying on latest update where you left (getting an offline ticket), it would make even R11 suite users to consider doing sub. I would do it even if I own almost all RS RE:s. I gladly support RS development that feels like a win-win for both new and experienced users.

And with that integration of users, eventually it would be possible to just call it Reason+ 2021 (the year it is on) and end the R-Xnumber route. You just sign on subscription to get the latest, and after x months, you get to keep where it is at (not the RE:s but you can buy them as before), but as RS will continue to develop at a faster pace and with new devices, users who took a little break, will soon be compelled to sign on another sub period to stay upfront. At least make the annual or a half-year plan get you out with a stable offline option after sub expires. The incentive to take new sub plans will be that RS keeps giving more and more value, so that keeps it attractive to sign on a sub plan. If you only go month by month, ok, that could be on your own risk and good for those who are pro´s and will make a project now and then involving Reason.

To leave you with nothing despite annual subscription is not far from Adobe. I do not trust the "you can buy Reason as before if you wish" as we know RS will from now on make everything cater around the R+, and that will be the focus. Who knows how long the ordinary buying cycle will be now when the R+ is their future aim? All is quite unclear what to expect both from R+ and ordinary Reason license route.