ReasonTalk.com

Where do think Reason (Studios) are heading in the next couple of years?

I know many people will have very different views and thoughts here and there's bound to be disagreements. Reason is important to all of us and it's easy to get emotional about something we care about.
It would be nice if everyone could express their thoughts without having anyone accusing someone else of being either a "tin foil hat" or a "Reason apologist". Just let people share their thoughts freely without feeling that need to go on the attack or to ridicule someone. In fact if someone disagrees with you and you feel that urge to respond, maybe try out some restraint this time and not respond at all.

Remember this is all speculations. Don't take it too seriously. Have fun speculating.

People working at Reason Studios are of course more than welcome to share their thoughts on the subject too.

They'll continue the way they've been going: occasional bug fixes, a handful of new devices - maybe a new synth and a couple of players - and some tinkering with the Combinator. (If I was going to take a stab at a specific device possibly a drum sound creator?) But I think there isn't a single person here who would happily have a year without new toys for some workflow sequencer updating qols.

I think the venture capitalists will sell up if there's a sniff of a buyer. Who knows after that?

I guess it will depend on who buys it and whether the current staff will be motivated by their direction or not? And whether the new owners feel they've got the right staff for their direction or not?

I hope things improve for everyone's sake.

I have very low expectations based on what happened in 2021. But hey, it's a new year.

More synths, players, effects.

Continuation of focus on the Rack Plugin, and less emphasis on the DAW itself, maybe even a phase out.


If anything innovative comes up, it will most likely be for the benefit of the plugin or specific devices, but I could possibly see them coming up with a way to better integrate the Plug-in with DAWs, possibly VST hosting, MPE support, eventually a better browser.

Because the way RS are heading they will need to do everything they can to make sure the Rack plugin integration is as tight as possible, as the VST market is probably even more competitive than DAW hosts themselves.

rorystorm wrote: ↑

08 Jan 2022

(If I was going to take a stab at a specific device possibly a drum sound creator?)

I would really hope instead of creating a new device, they should just update Kong.

I do kind of feel RS should start focusing more on the devices they already have and how to make them better than to keep creating totally new devices that does something an old device can't but can't do what the old device can.

Maschine and Ableton updated their Drum synths where it made sense. Kong hasn't been touched in over 10 years.

Zac wrote: ↑

08 Jan 2022

I think the venture capitalists will sell up if there's a sniff of a buyer. Who knows after that?

I guess it will depend on who buys it and whether the current staff will be motivated by their direction or not? And whether the new owners feel they've got the right staff for their direction or not?

I hope things improve for everyone's sake.

I have very low expectations based on what happened in 2021. But hey, it's a new year.

Hi Zac '

Long time , no speak ' Bro

Hope you are doing well & still shredding on Guitar

Yeahh

2021 was a Rough old year for me too , With RS12 , but as i have already said ' in previous post's
the real fault of my issues was the actual Computer / just barely meeting minimum standards .

So yeah , Long gone are the days when we could boast to the DAW World that Reason will Run on any old Machine

But i will say in Reason's defence ' I can not imagine the [ Programming that is taking place within the Belly of Reason!
[ Working on the whole Shell that RS sits in / Hi Res+] Kind'a Building from bottom up ' so to speak , which on the positive side
is always better late than never

So if you have not already read my post's I bought the update RS12 , & it will work to a certain point , but can't be trusted to complete anything.
so i switched back to RS11 , Not all was lost at sea 'tho I got Complex Synth ' without paying a penny , on the back of my REWARDS
from the Update : Tee he he , Big up from ENGLAND ' Zac .

RS, if they listen to their clients, will be fine.
Although I have a feeling the lust for hardware will be back big time around the world also.

Either one of two things will happen ...

1. Reason reaches a new audience
2. Reason loses some of its users and has to survive on a diet of thistles and bugs

I have my doubts about Reason being the DAW some desire it to be considering the rack (by their admission) is the core part of the DAW experience. They'll instead continue as they've always have: being a great hub for creativity that"s workable enough to finish songs in. I think their moves with R11, and R+ further cemented that. There's a lot of potential if they do it right.

I think the work that’s gone into hi res indicates that they genuinely want to advance the mission and take on the larger world somehow.
Why would you go to such trouble if you just wanted to tart it up for resale? Not exactly the shortest distance between points.
So, if I’m right, we’re prob in business short to med term.
I’m not worried about the dumping of the Daw for RRP development only. After all, it’s a business. And they’ve got a Daw there ready to sell and use.
I dont think Reason is properly placed to survive sub only like other outfits. If they try that I think they'll sink. The big boys can corner a market because of how there placed within the pro landscape. Industry standard gear. Reason is a toy to many or most and Rs seem to think they can sell subs with a never ending stream of content and new toys. Seems like an exhausting dead end, however much fun may be had by some along the way. It seems like the kind of thing people would tire of. But what do I know.
So provided they find a way forward without the subs I figure they’ll try n eek out improvements as slowly as they can because barring a radical new idea the only card to play is getting up to speed w everyone else, and they’ll want to earn as much from every added feature however standard it may be in the wider daw-verse. But that’s prob a one way street long term.
I hope they last another 10 yrs.
Got a few more ideas I wanna get out.

ReBirth 3.0



But, not sure. Been happily active since 1998 and hopefully they continue their run of being creative. Sure -- this and that could be like this or that -- or that thing in Reason could be better and etc. But it still works and imo is still great and forward thinking.

arnigretar wrote: ↑

08 Jan 2022

ReBirth 3.0



But, not sure. Been happily active since 1998 and hopefully they continue their run of being creative. Sure -- this and that could be like this or that -- or that thing in Reason could be better and etc. But it still works and imo is still great and forward thinking.

ReBirth 3.0???

Majestik Monkey wrote: ↑

08 Jan 2022

Zac wrote: ↑

08 Jan 2022

I think the venture capitalists will sell up if there's a sniff of a buyer. Who knows after that?

I guess it will depend on who buys it and whether the current staff will be motivated by their direction or not? And whether the new owners feel they've got the right staff for their direction or not?

I hope things improve for everyone's sake.

I have very low expectations based on what happened in 2021. But hey, it's a new year.

Hi Zac '

Long time , no speak ' Bro

Hope you are doing well & still shredding on Guitar

Yeahh

2021 was a Rough old year for me too , With RS12 , but as i have already said ' in previous post's
the real fault of my issues was the actual Computer / just barely meeting minimum standards .

So yeah , Long gone are the days when we could boast to the DAW World that Reason will Run on any old Machine

But i will say in Reason's defence ' I can not imagine the [ Programming that is taking place within the Belly of Reason!
[ Working on the whole Shell that RS sits in / Hi Res+] Kind'a Building from bottom up ' so to speak , which on the positive side
is always better late than never

So if you have not already read my post's I bought the update RS12 , & it will work to a certain point , but can't be trusted to complete anything.
so i switched back to RS11 , Not all was lost at sea 'tho I got Complex Synth ' without paying a penny , on the back of my REWARDS
from the Update : Tee he he , Big up from ENGLAND ' Zac .

Hello, I'm thinking of getting the axe out for a Jamuary video. Hope you get to use R12 soon! All the best

My only real hope is that the Propellerhead company gets back into the control over a firm and/or company which values music and musical expression over pure profits.

Now, this may sound dumb considering that in the end all companies thrive on profit. But there's a huge difference between the goals of an investor who's only goal is to see the investment pay out through bigger payments (thus: seeing the company generate more revenue one way or the other) vs. that of someone who wants to see the company be protitable and succeed in what it's doing. So even a break even would be acceptable. Yet that's not what the general investor wants or seeks.

I can plain out admit that my conspiracy theory is kinda stupid because my main drive is slight fanboy'ism. Having that out of the way... I can't help imagine what might happen if Ableton were to purchase Reason Studios.

Please hear me out... Yes, I am a Live "fanboy" if you will (having used Live for over 10 years now does that to you) but out of most of those recent 10 years Reason was the huge big #2. Where most people picked up Komplete I went Reason and never regretted that one moment.

My point here is that although I highly doubt that this is going to happen Ableton have been here before with Cycling '74. It started as a joint venture (getting Max (= visual programming language geared towards multimedia) embedded into Live). Fast forward 8 or so years later and now Ableton took over and bought Cycling '74. The thing is... it's been several years and from an outside perspective it's still Cycling '74 as it always has been. We still have Max, Max is still being developed and on top of it we have Max for Live.

Of course... at the same time you also see new developments within Live (where Max used to be an external runtime it is now more or less embedded within the Live environment).

I can't help be convinced that if this were to become a thing then both Reason and Live could get a massive boost where overal functionality is concerned. Because if there's one thing I've learned over the past years it's that Reason was waay ahead of its time. In a way it still is today.

Of course if this would also be financially feasible is something I can't really predict. It's also why I don't see this happening any time soon.

But even so... I think that in these difficult financial times some multimedia companies will have no other choice but to somehow cluster together or participate in joint ventures in order to survive.

I think rs will continue in the same way it has over the last few years. I assume we will see more devices and players to keep new stuff appearing for subscribers and assume fx will be the next devices as struggling to think of what synth types reason is missing. Perhaps they will go more into sampled content like kontakt etc but personally more sceptical they would go this route.

Perhaps they will create a blank rack with just midi out and give this away free with player devices so other daw users can buy them at an affordable rate without having to buy full reason or subscribe to r+. If someone just wanted to buy the one rs player they want this opens a revenue stream for rs that may be attractive to some customers.

I also expect many more sales on r+ over the next few years and for these sales to be less frequent once numbers at a significant level for rs. Perpetual licence I expect to go on sale for £99 at some point in 2022 (my guess black Friday).

All the above is just pie in the sky and my thoughts and I am probably miles off. Just based on how I perceive things at the moment. We need Enochlight to post as he was spookily on the money last time we had a prediction thread

Reason Studios is headed towards being bought out by Apple and getting absorbed into Logic Pro.

If the lack of Reason Studios rack extension sales over Black Friday and beyond is any indicator, I think R12 will be the last perpetual release. I could feel invisible hands in the small of my back pushing me ever towards Reason+.

RS just now how to kill a business :
- killing Rebirth
- killing Recycle
- killing the Combinator community with RE
- killing RE with late VST hosting
- born killing Combinator 2 community because of RE and VST
- Killing Reason with subcription model

Unless they chose Life over Death, I don't think they will survive a lot of time with such mentality

RS (Reason Studio) in fact means Reason Slaughter.

It's just so sad how a so smart initial idea is killed by sucessive dumb strategies

Shoukz wrote: ↑

12 Jan 2022

RS just now how to kill a business :
- killing Rebirth
- killing Recycle
- killing the Combinator community with RE
- killing RE with late VST hosting
- born killing Combinator 2 community because of RE and VST
- Killing Reason with subcription model

Unless they chose Life over Death, I don't think they will survive a lot of time with such mentality

RS (Reason Studio) in fact means Reason Slaughter.

It's just so sad how a so smart initial idea is killed by sucessive dumb strategies

Can't say I can agree with any of this besides Rebirth being dead.

deeplink wrote: ↑

12 Jan 2022

Shoukz wrote: ↑

12 Jan 2022

RS just now how to kill a business :
- killing Rebirth
- killing Recycle
- killing the Combinator community with RE
- killing RE with late VST hosting
- born killing Combinator 2 community because of RE and VST
- Killing Reason with subcription model

Unless they chose Life over Death, I don't think they will survive a lot of time with such mentality

RS (Reason Studio) in fact means Reason Slaughter.

It's just so sad how a so smart initial idea is killed by sucessive dumb strategies

Can't say I can agree with any of this besides Rebirth being dead.

Well, Recycle is a bit like the undead really. Its functionality split between the stand alone and the daw. It's ridiculous. And now that everyone is seemingly happy enough with the half baked lite version in Reason...well, there's another thread for complaining about that I guess.

Shoukz wrote: ↑

12 Jan 2022

- killing the Combinator community with RE
- killing RE with late VST hosting
- born killing Combinator 2 community because of RE and VST

REs can do things that combinators cannot do. REs can do things that VSTs cannot do. Combinators can do things that neither REs or VSTs can do, specifically 'combine' anything with everything that is available inside Reason, including VSTs (outside the RRP). VSTs give access to many instruments and FX that are not available natively in Reason or as a RE.

I don't see how any of these three is 'killing' any of the other ones.

I suspect there well be another change of CEO despite the current promise to be more open and listen.

Whilst this is more true than ever, I feel a remaining lack of honesty and openness with their current user base is causing lots of speculation and continued harm to the reputation.

I honestly don't know of another company that is so tone deaf and bloody minded. The have been lots of great ideas that haven't been taken up because they are still playing their cards closer to their chest.

However the RS board table probably leads to a completed corporate landscape and there maybe too many clueless execs involved in decision making now.

There is still time to turn things around, but annoying you loyal customers isn't the right way to go.

If they manage to retain their development staff then they will trundle on as before up until it's time for investment firm to offload their purchase ( in 5 years time?).

Strangely the user base are ALL routing for them but they don't realise it and in my short time as a reason owner, they appear to intent on cheesing off the customer and RE development community.

Having said that I was REALLY surprised by how much I have spent this year on reason and RE purchases. 1/3 have been speculative purchases that I haven't really used either. Doh!
If I was subscribing I would be less inclined to shop in store and would just buy VSTs instead, no doubt.

Shoukz wrote: ↑

12 Jan 2022

RS just now how to kill a business :
- killing Rebirth
- killing Recycle
- killing the Combinator community with RE
- killing RE with late VST hosting
- born killing Combinator 2 community because of RE and VST
- Killing Reason with subcription model

Don't be so melodramatic. Only one of those things is dead and that is (ironically?) Rebirth, and that was killed off by threats/discussion with Roland.

Just checking they own roadmap you can tell there is no interest on improve Reason Daw... so, that's it, I'm sticking with R10 for long it seems.

I wouldn't say that there is no interest in adding improvements to the daw every version has brought improvement, maybe not the improvements that many of us would like to see but there has always been something added.

I've tried using a few daws over the years and Reason for me still offers the best workflow, now maybe that's because it was my first daw and I've been using it since version 1 but either way every time I try a new daw I instantly think I'm glad Reason hasn't done some of the things that others have requested and although I still think it could be better I definitely prefer Reason over all the others.

I just hope they don't throw it all away in favour of some subscription rack plugin product but expect that they are going to continue and develop RRP until it's the best it can be it just unfortunate that it is at the expense of standalone for the moment.