New players are amazing

[deepndark]

I think this is a final upgrade I really needed. Gonna save my money for the other stuff in the near-future. Big cudos, Yess!

[MarkTarlton]

I really like the drum player too! my wish right now is to make the randomize feature programmable in a combinator.

[jimmyklane]

So how many people have really “bought in” to all the players? I have 10.1, so of course I grabbed the drum sequencer and love the probability function especially...however the rest of them are paid REs and perhaps will be the very first REs that I’ve ever purchased. I’m deep into a hardware setup, but have recently started using the various players to get inspired with new chord ideas and rhythmic patterns.

So, how many of you have purchased the newest Player devices and what are you using them for specifically?

[deepndark]

I lied and was sarcastic by saying I have any kind of use of the Players. I'm just too busy to bother with these toys.

[moneykube]

lol... have not had time to open reason since update

[jimmyklane]

I lied and was sarcastic by saying I have any kind of use of the Players. I'm just too busy to bother with these toys.

I have just began to use them. I’m not sure how you could be using Reason and be too busy to use it’s tools....I mean a commercial studio wouldn’t use Reason for more than a rewired sound module into PT or similar, and even soundtrack production like what I’m doing can find occasional inspiration in them. Make a little time for Scales and Chords at least....it’s pretty interesting if you’re working in a particular mode....I was writing something in C Lydian the other day, and when programmed to Eminor gave some very interesting results that were out of the box compared to what I was writing.

[deepndark]

I lied and was sarcastic by saying I have any kind of use of the Players. I'm just too busy to bother with these toys.

I have just began to use them. I’m not sure how you could be using Reason and be too busy to use it’s tools....I mean a commercial studio wouldn’t use Reason for more than a rewired sound module into PT or similar, and even soundtrack production like what I’m doing can find occasional inspiration in them. Make a little time for Scales and Chords at least....it’s pretty interesting if you’re working in a particular mode....I was writing something in C Lydian the other day, and when programmed to Eminor gave some very interesting results that were out of the box compared to what I was writing.

I understand the concept of the players for their functions, but for me they are not easy for a programmer, who wants to focus to make music with. All the players are causing lots of brainf*uck, when u want to "fly" and "create".
I just watched the video that introduced this thing. The architecture is really really bad in this. It should be as simple as ReDrum, with the same functions. ReDrum is for a producer, who wants to have a total control over programming, but Players are not IMO, they have the poorest focus/control value of all the Propellerheads devices ever created IMHO. Simple, Monotonic GUI + Total overlook of functions is what it should be... That's why I'm not bothered.

[deepndark]

I would like to see a ReDrum + Drum Sequencer Hybrid.
Just an expance arrow below Redrum + all the functions as in a Player - for every ReDrum channel.
Then you'd press between the channel switch's and apply the same tricks as they are in a Drum Sequencer.
Wink Wink!

[Ottostrom]

I understand the concept of the players for their functions, but for me they are not easy for a programmer, who wants to focus to make music with. All the players are causing lots of brainf*uck, when u want to "fly" and "create".
I just watched the video that introduced this thing. The architecture is really really bad in this. It should be as simple as ReDrum, with the same functions. ReDrum is for a producer, who wants to have a total control over programming, but Players are not IMO, they have the poorest focus/control value of all the Propellerheads devices ever created IMHO. Simple, Monotonic GUI + Total overlook of functions is what it should be... That's why I'm not bothered.

But comparing ReDrum and the Drum Sequencer is not fair since players never are the sound source themselves, so they always need to be paired up with another device. This is part of what makes them great, cause you are not restricted to only use them with certain devices. They are one of the most simple to use devices added to Reason (definitely in terms of controlling/morphing the midi data) so I really don't see where all this "brainf*ucking" is coming from.

[deepndark]

I understand the concept of the players for their functions, but for me they are not easy for a programmer, who wants to focus to make music with. All the players are causing lots of brainf*uck, when u want to "fly" and "create".
I just watched the video that introduced this thing. The architecture is really really bad in this. It should be as simple as ReDrum, with the same functions. ReDrum is for a producer, who wants to have a total control over programming, but Players are not IMO, they have the poorest focus/control value of all the Propellerheads devices ever created IMHO. Simple, Monotonic GUI + Total overlook of functions is what it should be... That's why I'm not bothered.

But comparing ReDrum and the Drum Sequencer is not fair since players never are the sound source themselves, so they always need to be paired up with another device. This is part of what makes them great, cause you are not restricted to only use them with certain devices. They are one of the most simple to use devices added to Reason (definitely in terms of controlling/morphing the midi data) so I really don't see where all this "brainf*ucking" is coming from.

Ok, if you like em, cool beans, but I'm used to create stuff by not being lost while programming. So that's why Redrum 2 would be a tool for ME. It's a Toy to experiment and getting happy accidents IMO.

[deepndark]

The players remind me of my take on of this: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=7506171
That would be my choice instead of the Player-family, when tricks, whitles and bling-blings would be required to be added to some of the stripes.

[deepndark]

One pattern at a time would make it easier.
Draw pencil to add a note-lenght by choice. i.e. Menu for a note lenght by right clicking on every note.
Draw bar at the top to cut earlier if needed. (Speed)
ETC. Ah, well...

Mute/Solo At the very left.
A view for all the 8 channels maybe like it is as well then?
But solo view for every 1-8 in a big clean view and everything ready for to try.
All the trick features below all the notes as the velocity also is etc.
Shuffle/Slide at the left.
Garphics, super-easy for the eyes etc.

Bottom line: Conservative simplicity rocks!

[Ottostrom]

Ok, if you like em, cool beans, but I'm used to create stuff by not being lost while programming. So that's why Redrum 2 would be a tool for ME. It's a Toy to experiment and getting happy accidents IMO.

Believe it or not but I'm also used to creating stuff by not being lost while programming. They are even placed above the desired sound source so visualising the signal flow becomes even easier. I understand this is all just your opinion, but you dismiss them as toys only by the fact that you have difficulty understanding them. People labeled Reason as a toy too until they actually gave it a chance.

[deepndark]

Ok, if you like em, cool beans, but I'm used to create stuff by not being lost while programming. So that's why Redrum 2 would be a tool for ME. It's a Toy to experiment and getting happy accidents IMO.

Believe it or not but I'm also used to creating stuff by not being lost while programming. They are even placed above the desired sound source so visualising the signal flow becomes even easier. I understand this is all just your opinion, but you dismiss them as toys only by the fact that you have difficulty understanding them. People labeled Reason as a toy too until they actually gave it a chance.

Reason itself ain't a Toy for me, just poorly made solutions are called as that to explain how I feel when using them.
I just think I have lots of skills/eye to make things better.

[jimmyklane]

I have just began to use them. I’m not sure how you could be using Reason and be too busy to use it’s tools....I mean a commercial studio wouldn’t use Reason for more than a rewired sound module into PT or similar, and even soundtrack production like what I’m doing can find occasional inspiration in them. Make a little time for Scales and Chords at least....it’s pretty interesting if you’re working in a particular mode....I was writing something in C Lydian the other day, and when programmed to Eminor gave some very interesting results that were out of the box compared to what I was writing.

I understand the concept of the players for their functions, but for me they are not easy for a programmer, who wants to focus to make music with. All the players are causing lots of brainf*uck, when u want to "fly" and "create".
I just watched the video that introduced this thing. The architecture is really really bad in this. It should be as simple as ReDrum, with the same functions. ReDrum is for a producer, who wants to have a total control over programming, but Players are not IMO, they have the poorest focus/control value of all the Propellerheads devices ever created IMHO. Simple, Monotonic GUI + Total overlook of functions is what it should be... That's why I'm not bothered.

NOW I understand. Yeah, it took me 30 minutes to program a 4-bar loop in Drum Seq the other day, so that’s exactly what you’re talking about....would have taken me 10 including the sampling and trimming in any drum machine I own, even counting the repeats/ratchets, and such.

I guess my point is this: on occasion, when you’re not under deadline, the players can force you to make different choices and write differently which of course is great for your music.

[deepndark]

The concept of these devices are good like I said. But, it's like buying a lottery, you don't have a big clue when you want to turn your brain-seguencing into reality, like you can with Matrix, ReDrum etc. Maybe some new devices are required, that cover this as well. =)

[Ottostrom]

NOW I understand. Yeah, it took me 30 minutes to program a 4-bar loop in Drum Seq the other day, so that’s exactly what you’re talking about....would have taken me 10 including the sampling and trimming in any drum machine I own, even counting the repeats/ratchets, and such.

I guess my point is this: on occasion, when you’re not under deadline, the players can force you to make different choices and write differently which of course is great for your music.

Your point assumes that you have to relearn how to use it every time you want to make another 4-bar loop which is just silly.
There is a learning period with any new device before you start working fast and efficiently with it, but both you and deepndark feel entitled to have this knowledge already only because you have worked with other drum sequencers before and refuse to acknowledge this as its own device.

[jimmyklane]

NOW I understand. Yeah, it took me 30 minutes to program a 4-bar loop in Drum Seq the other day, so that’s exactly what you’re talking about....would have taken me 10 including the sampling and trimming in any drum machine I own, even counting the repeats/ratchets, and such.

I guess my point is this: on occasion, when you’re not under deadline, the players can force you to make different choices and write differently which of course is great for your music.

Your point assumes that you have to relearn how to use it every time you want to make another 4-bar loop which is just silly.
There is a learning period with any new device before you start working fast and efficiently with it, but both you and deepndark feel entitled to have this knowledge already only because you have worked with other drum sequencers before and refuse to acknowledge this as its own device.

I disagree with you assessment of my point....mostly because I’m not at all bashing the new Drum Sequencer! If you read my posts above you’ll see that I’m defending the usefulness of the player devices as spurs to creativity. And it’s true: I made a beat that I’d not have made in a linear sequencer, and pure xox sequencers tend to have me adding a few too many percussion instruments because you can. I actually think it’s a very handy little device, and I absolutely acknowledge it as it’s own unique device in the peopellerhead stable.

I especially have enjoyed it driving EMDs as both tonal and percussive inspiration.

[joeyluck]

I lied and was sarcastic by saying I have any kind of use of the Players. I'm just too busy to bother with these toys.

First it's the upgrade you really needed...

Then you regard the Players as toys...

Then you go on to say you think they're too complicated...you say it should be as simple as Redrum

Then you say you'd like to see Drum Sequencer and all it's features incorporated into a Redrum 2...

So just put Drum Sequencer on top of Redrum...Boom...Redrum 2

[chimp_spanner]

Well seeing how Drum Sequencer - although launched with the announcement of 10.1 - isn't *actually* part of 10.1, but rather a soon-to-be-paid example of what can be done with the new SDK, there's no point getting bent out of shape over what it is or isn't. Buy Kompulsion instead. It's the same money. Or use any of the other third party solutions that exist in RE format. I'm not suggesting people shouldn't give their opinions and feedback. But I refuse to believe that with all of the players currently available, plus whatever rack extensions we all own already, PLUS what comes with Reason, P L U S its actual sequencer...that any of Drum Sequencer's shortcomings amount to a major barrier or obstacle to making music. Just...do it.

[deepndark]

I lied and was sarcastic by saying I have any kind of use of the Players. I'm just too busy to bother with these toys.

First it's the upgrade you really needed...

Then you regard the Players as toys...

Then you go on to say you think they're too complicated...you say it should be as simple as Redrum

Then you say you'd like to see Drum Sequencer and all it's features incorporated into a Redrum 2...

So just put Drum Sequencer on top of Redrum...Boom...Redrum 2

Hey, I have had good visions to turn Reason into more powerful tool, like lots of the times before, so shhhh.....!

[deepndark]

Shhhhhh....!

[deepndark]

I lied and was sarcastic by saying I have any kind of use of the Players. I'm just too busy to bother with these toys.

First it's the upgrade you really needed...

Then you regard the Players as toys...

Then you go on to say you think they're too complicated...you say it should be as simple as Redrum

Then you say you'd like to see Drum Sequencer and all it's features incorporated into a Redrum 2...

So just put Drum Sequencer on top of Redrum...Boom...Redrum 2

If you woulda read my second post as well, I clearly stated I was sarcastic about it being dreams come true.

Player are Toys for me and for my team members even more.

They are complicated because of the layout and logic put into them, not otherwise at all.

Redrum + this Toy, are nothing worth, compared to, what I would like them to be.