Wake up guys...

[bitley]

Please allow a question from a guy with moderate synth programming capabilities:

These are samples from old synths, right? How close could you get soundwise with modern VA synths like Thor, Antidote or Predator (and possibly som external fx)?

Not close at all, totally different thing That's why this soundbank is so fun. It sounds like nothing else.

[The_G]

Just want to add that WBF2 is waaaaaaay more than just a Fairlight sample pack. Lots of other goodies in there as well, and it sounds lightyears better than any other ReFill I've ever bought. Actually not long ago I bought a sample pack of classic analog synth patches for Logic and Live when it was on sale. Does not hold a card to WBF2.

[dana]

You really need to get a grip, your marketing strategy does nothing for you.

[Dante]

As a concept, preserving Fairlight is even better than preserving Mellotron. And I would say the ReTron interface is way better than M-Tron (which tries to look like the real Mellotron with a coffee stain). Make no mistake - I think the Way Beyond Fairlight pack is excellent value and hope to buy it one day some way or another. In terms of re-packaging in future :

1) Come up with an RE interface that includes the 'green screen' pages or concept of the Fairlight but done way better than DarkLight (that will be a challenge).
2) Shows off parameter controls that make it more like an synth instrument than a sample pack - in the same way 'ReTron' does (attack / sustain / filters etc) with these controls having excellent graphics same as ReTron.
3) Some inbuilt effects - like ReTron has delay and ensemble voice / detune mix etc.
4) Consider getting rid of the other non-Fairlight sounds (they could remain a separate Refill) since its better to have a purpose built RE with specific target. This would make the pack (or RE) far more focused. EG ReTron does not have a load of other non relevant - eg - string synths for example

Maybe it would look something (SDK restrictions apply) like :

bitley-RE-2.jpg (157.4 KiB) Viewed 1805 times

[Libraquaricorn]

I just bought that wbf summer deal at the ridiculous price of 55$ and overwhelmed as I am, I'm pretty sure it's the best value refill purchase I've ever done. The prop shop booster packs are not even close when it comes to value, so WBF @ 55$ equals a no-brainer. A re version would be sweet though but probably a lot more expensive, so I'm happy I finally got my hands on the refill at this point.

[joeyluck]

No plans like that at all. Totally impossible mission.

You could always start a Kickstarter campaign...
But there are also some great graphic designers and budding developers in our community that might be excited enough about it to lend you some of their time to bring it to fruition.

I envision a series. One RE in particular that focuses just on the CMI and it's unique interface. It's arguably 50% of the selling point of wanting a Fairlight CMI in your rack. You could recreate a handful of the Combinators from the ReFill to include as presets (at which point, should mostly just be dragging and dropping the CMI RE on top of the NNXT). It's clearly the next step to boost sales. Having it in the shop and having a great interface that does the CMI justice would grab many users' attention.

[bitley]

Thanks, but having a mockup Fairlight look has never been on my radar, as I wanted to use it as an ingredient in something different and more modern sounding. I knew it could be done and it's what successfully has been made. The product is already way beyond the Fairlight in all senses soundwise. It CAN do the old sounds pretty well but it also can do lots of things you wouldn't be able to do on a Fairlight, at least not simultaneously.

For the RE kind of thing people envision, something more like Peter Vogel's own iPad app would be fitting for a rewrite / coding reuse possibly. He could perhaps even use bits from his Fairlight CMI 30A.

This product is more of a Roland JV / XV / Yamaha Motif (etc) kind of software instrument, a multitimbral workhorse with all sounds Reason needed, in my view, to feel more complete and fun to use. It kind of pinpoints everything Reason does not have and solves that. A music production ready addon with all the drum sounds and synth sounds I want to have access to, that Reason didn't have.

The Fairlight was seldom used standalone back in the 80's: it was surrounded with all sorts of synths, drum machines, effects, and its sounds were layered up with analog and digital synths, as on Jan Hammer's Miami Vice tracks for instance. So therefore I sampled LOADS of instruments and added to the picture. Jupiter 4, JX8P, TR-series drum machines, Prophet 5, DX7, D-50, CZ-5000 etc etc. All of them multisampled and ready for sound layering and creative programming. The Fairlight character being available and possible to add as extra icing on the cake.

[ReasonUser]

I just bought that wbf summer deal at the ridiculous price of 55$ and overwhelmed as I am, I'm pretty sure it's the best value refill purchase I've ever done. The prop shop booster packs are not even close when it comes to value, so WBF @ 55$ equals a no-brainer. A re version would be sweet though but probably a lot more expensive, so I'm happy I finally got my hands on the refill at this point.

$55 ? Summer deal says $88 !

[Dante]

That's a fair enough statement of product positioning. For someone like me who only wants Fairlight, and something close to the GUI and feel of Fairlight, I would go for DarkLight but unfortunately that breaks my Rack Extension work flow. I invested heavily in VST before Rack Extensions but now have not purchased any VST since RE came out, and have instead gradually replaced all I can VST with RE and have most basses covered, and all work @96KHz. For the same reasons I would not go for an iPad emulation.

By the same token I would never buy DarkLight even though its ultimately what I want as a Fairlight exploration, simply because its a VST and I don't run any VST hosts and wish to stick to an RE exclusive work flow and integration. Not to mention DarkLight requires ilOK! My love of Fairlight extends beyond just the sounds - but also the concept, feel, workflow and GUI.

So there is still a functional / market gap IHMO for a REFairLight, and yes I would pay more for it than a ReFill - e.g. I see it on a similar price point as ProjectSAM started with (e.g. SAM is discounted now but a Fairlight RE I would consider even if slightly above the original SAM RE price).

$55 for a Fairlight Refill - excellent value. Keep this product.
$160 - $200 for a Fairlight RE with only Fairlight sounds (based on the same meticulous sampling work as the ReFill) - I would buy that instead. I don't see any reason why a well forged Fairlight RE wouldnt be worth double the price of ReTron, and be better than DarkLight which requires extra software (the UVIWorkStation wrapper) to run.

So we would then have 2 separate products. One for the 'Way Beyond' market, and one for the 'Authentics / Nostalgics' who were actually born back then before the 80s.

[yeahright31]

I own the 1st Bitley Fairlight, having said that it's getting close to the time I admit, I need to wake up and get the Way Beyond Fairlight.
Much gratitude to you Bitley for the Several years of work put into this refill.

I can say that i'm way too spoil for choice and when I open Reason 8 then all the Refills & RE scream- use me I pick 2 or 3 refills then work around that and use fx and then even at times look at a very colorful dogs breakfast of a session. Haha.

It's just endless and relentless how much Refills/RE is available, so I wanna just focus on using what I have for few weeks, because it's endless, I got hardware i'm sampling and adding fx over, i'm trying to hide the wallet from myself and save because there is always something I could buy.
When I stop hiding away - Way Beyond Fairlight will be top of my to buy list for sure.

[joeyluck]

It's a great ReFill. But I was most interested in the NNXT ReFill which was just the Fairlight patches dry of any effects. I missed it as it was no longer available. But I picked up WBF. I really only use the NNXT patches from it though.

[mreese80]

Anything Bitley is a plus. Even tho i have WBF i still go to fairlight xxl. That was the first refill that had sounds that i could use in my music. That was also when i started learning the instrument layouts and patches. Reason was confusing to me in the early stages even tho i loved it. The nn xt is always my go to for anything. i always start there.

[Libraquaricorn]

I just bought that wbf summer deal at the ridiculous price of 55$ and overwhelmed as I am, I'm pretty sure it's the best value refill purchase I've ever done. The prop shop booster packs are not even close when it comes to value, so WBF @ 55$ equals a no-brainer. A re version would be sweet though but probably a lot more expensive, so I'm happy I finally got my hands on the refill at this point.

$55 ? Summer deal says $88 !

I guess I was extra lucky then. I paid 55 a couple of days ago. Still: Crazy value!

[bitley]

OK

I'll bring it down to $55 again, dont' hold back!

[ravasb]

OK

I'll bring it down to $55 again, dont' hold back!

Thank you!

[ravasb]

I appreciate your responsiveness. Just bought WBS

[ReasonUser]

OK

I'll bring it down to $55 again, dont' hold back!

That's awesome! I'm sure you've posted this before, but can you (or anyone) clarify the difference between WBF and WBS?

WBF has a lot more content? Is any content repeated between the two? Is WBS worth it if you already have WBF?

Consider making a comparison page. Or maybe I just missed it. Thanks

[bitley]

No content repeated between them. Fairlight vs Synclavier. Both are genuine and cool

[selig]

Thanks, but having a mockup Fairlight look has never been on my radar, as I wanted to use it as an ingredient in something different and more modern sounding.

Yes, but USING something MUCH closer to a REAL CMI, not to mention all those other instruments, to create these modern sounds would SURELY be better than using an NNXT for everything? The NNXT filters, LFOs, and Envelopes are not the same as the ones in all these classic synths you sampled - are you saying you're satisfied with using one filter for almost every classic synth ever made?

Thought experiment: Imagine creating these same sounds using the original hardware for all the amazing patches you've created. Can you honestly say you'd prefer the limitation of samples and a single filter/lfo/env type over anything even partly closer to the originals? Imagine multiple filter types, drawable LFOS/Envelopes, advanced and SPECIFICALLY TUNED FX, just to name a few.

Then there's the UI issues: I ABSOLUTELY WISH I had a better UI for my Selig B3-Leslie. Combinators are great, but as a UI for the front end they are EXTREMELY LIMITED.

Then there's the copy protection and the additional ways to earn a living from your hard work to consider; selling the REs individually, as a bundle, as a part of a ReFill(s)… - unless making a living from your sound design work isn't important to you, of course.

Naturally, if you're happy with the current limitations and restrictions on all of the above, keep on keeping on - I just hear you say many things that would all be addressed by going this route as I've suggested many times before. As someone who has experienced selling both ReFills and REs, as well as someone sympathetic to your situation (I've been reading your pleas for more customers/sales for years now), I hope you will at least consider my perspective.

OK, I've beaten this dead horse one more time just in case you're listening - my apologies if any offense is taken with my words: the are intended to inspire not to condemn!

[bitley]

I rarely feel limited by Reason, there are always ways to work around and invent new solutions. I never blame my tools.

[Dante]

I wonder if the prospect of REFairLight $$ income would change Mr Ernsts tune ?

[selig]

I rarely feel limited by Reason, there are always ways to work around and invent new solutions. I never blame my tools.

If you're responding to me, the I don't follow - are you saying a single oscillator with no filter or envelope is as powerful a tool as a full modular synth? Or do you agree there are some tools that can do things others cannot? What exactly is your point?

[I'll just add that i'm trying to help with something I KNOW will bring in way more $$$ for you, but you don't seem interested in that at the moment - carry on my friend!]

[tt_lab]

Hi Bitley. You said the update form WFB to WFB2 was on sale to on another post...but I can not find it, and I don't think going from 49$ to 55$ is to be on sale. Can you provide a link to where I can find the update price cheaper than 49$?

[Soundcells]

'... Refills normally take five hours to make ...' - Patrick! Really?? Sorry - but that's totally shit!!!
I have produced a lot of ReFills over the last ten years, and it always was not about five hours but more about five weeks (and in most cases a lot more) ... not to speak from producing the demo tracks as a further step ...

I really wish you a lot of success with all your ReFills and sound libraries in general - but *please* do not talk in such a negative way (which may affect the work others have done)! That's only bad publicity ... for you too!

Best regards,
Harald | Soundcells

[Dante]

Before the prospect of PX7 - I built a Refill made up of my top 10 DX7 sounds, 2 samples per octave. Probably took me a couple of hours to make, coming to grips with the toolset (refill packer).

Nothing really worth marketing but it did the trick. I'm thinking to make something marketable yes would take a lot longer than even 5 hours. Maybe more like 50. And indeed I believe the WBF refill obviously took humongous amounts of hours to create.

But whether a refill takes 5, 50 or 500 hours to make is not really the point from a buyers perspective, there is still a difference between an instrument VST/RE and a sample pack.

Even though the sample pack may be way more than most others its still not a dedicated instrument plugin. If it was, why bother making ReTron ? Why not just bundle samples of a Mellotron together ? Whether the original Mellotron was sampled, or the original Mellotron tapes digitized direct and painstakingly compiled into something playable over 500 hours its still a sample pack (with a somewhat generic UI) rather than a virtual instrument with a specialized UI (whether its an imitation of the original UI or 'enhanced' (such as ReTron) ).

I also think its correct not to blame ones tools, but being selective about them at buying time is a different story altogether.